Here are the facts, as I can discern them from this poorly written piece of mangina journalism from The Hairpin:
- Author Jeremy Paul Gordon served as bodyguard for a girl named E. who was on her way to pay a guy $5 she owed him after she stiffed him on cab fare.
- E. stiffed the guy because he called her a cunt.
- The stiffed man called E. a cunt because she got really drunk at a party and cursed at him.
Drawing on his own experience, and ignoring the possibility that E. was being a cunt, Jeremy advised E. that she had a very sharp weapon in her tool shed that she should wield at the guy she stiffed if he should become verbally confrontational while she was handing him his five dollar bill. The word that “makes us [men] stay up at night”.
The C word.
Cialis?
No.
“Creep”.
Here’s Jeremy, sounding like Shaggy from Scooby Doo:
E_____,” I started, “Even if he shit-talks you, you have the upper hand. Because you know girls, and because you can lay the worst thing on him that a guy can be called.”
“What’s that?” she asked.
“You can call him creepy.”
Zoinks!
Jeremy Paul Gordon (on her deathbed, my grandmother told me to never trust a man with three first names) should have sympathy for C-word recipients since he relates a particularly disturbing personal experience with the pejorative:
Ironically, the last time I got called creepy it was because I was hitting on someone, but hear me out. (OMG! You were hitting on someone? As in a wooooman? Explain yourself misogynist!)
I’d met this girl at a party and we’d spent spent most of the night talking, drinking, commiserating, etc., and at one point she’d looked me in the eye and literally said “I like you.” Then she asked me to walk her home to her apartment 20 minutes away. I’m not bright, but I’m not blind. We left the party and walked to her apartment, where this exchange occurred.
Her: “So, I think I’m just gonna go upstairs and go to sleep.”
Me: “Uh… really?”
Her: “Yeah, I think I’m tired.”
Me: “Are you sure?”
Her: “Well, what did you expect?”
Me: “I don’t know, I thought maybe you were thinking of inviting me in?”
Her: “That’s weird. It’s kind of creepy of you to think something was going to happen just because we left together.”
Of course the gap between the girl’s “I like you” and their arrival at her apartment looms as large as the one in the Nixon Watergate tapes. Odds are, Jeremy had his ego pelted with creep-shot because he either has negative game or failed to maintain the chick’s buzz.
After the nuclear rejection, Jeremy mumbled some sort of apology then dazedly stalked to his bus stop. Showing that he would still have no game even if given a Time Machine and was led dick-first by Aphrodite herself, Jeremy retrospectively waffled between telling the girl “sorry to disturb you, good night” and “Fuck you tramp”.
While he doesn’t realize it, Jeremy’s Costanza-esque soliloquy of “should have saids” is actually the creepiest part of the whole exchange – by conventional definition. Women define creepy very broadly. Weakness is creepy. Anger is creepy. Any man who lets a woman he hasn’t been intimate with ruffle his feathers is considered creepy. Any man who raises his voice is considered a creep. Any man who curses at a woman for any reason is considered a creep. Any man who hides his true feelings is considered a patented Nice Guy who is secretly seething underneath his scaly exterior. He is also a big fucking creep.
But this girl provided a new twist on what constitutes creepiness. Like some sort of courtship Chinese finger trap, any man who asks for something from a girl and is rejected is a creep. Thus, men who don’t have Game, good looks, or status and who expect any romance from women are creeps. It is not enough to even consider these men losers anymore. Losers just exist in their own cesspool of loserdom; creeps, some would have us think, actively push their creepiness on us like a guy selling knock-off perfume out of his trunk.
Jeremy had no thought, either instinctively or in his multiple mental iterations, of taking either a cocky-funny tack or taking the opportunity to socially shame this pixie. Even in the face of her cold response, Jeremy could have at least mustered a “Umm, OK, can I pee on the bushes then?” or “I charge $5 for the lift and $1.25 for each additional five minutes. Tips accepted”. Extend hand and stare straight at her. Clear throat for effect. Pee in the bushes anyway.
Granted, this girl’s audacity deserved more than a humorous response (but certainly not an apology of any sort). Perhaps a simple “Why else do you think I walked you home?” would have sufficed. I would have preferred a straightforward “Here’s a hint, sweetie, don’t express interest in a man and then ask him to make a 40 minute round trip for your own safety and comfort if you’re not willing to give something in return. You’re not that precious.” An even tone mixed with facial disgust.
And while logic most certainly wouldn’t work on a girl like this (and is likely to reinforce her creep charge in her own eyes) it might be fun to point out that she closed the curtain on the evening by saying “so I think I’m just gonna go to bed” instead of “Well, goodnight and thank you”. Even though this girl propositioned Jeremy for a walk home, she turned the tables on him and made him look like a jerk for thinking that her come-ons meant something. Her qualification implies that she knew an upstairs invitation was expected. Therefore Jeremy’s consternation was not creepy at all. But girls have tits and, thus, no need for logic, etiquette, or manners.
Point is, she called him a creep after leading him on, yet the neophyte is telling grrlfriend E. that she should pull that same H-bomb out of her purse.
Jeremy goes on to explain that the guy E. was trying to pay back was a creep because he told E., up front, that he couldn’t work with her on a project “because he was attracted to her and didn’t want to waste time laughing at her crummy ideas while slowly trying to convince her to touch his penis.”
Yet E. is trekking across town with an LJBF strapped to her inner thigh in order to give a five-dollar bill to a guy who called her a cunt. She’s doing this after the guy laid down the Royal Flush of all negs by telling her that he didn’t want to suffer her pitiful ideas and that he only wanted to get into her pants. AND SHE TRAVELS TO HIS APARTMENT IN ORDER TO GIVE THE GUY BARELY ENOUGH MONEY TO BUY A MIDNIGHT SNACK.
Upon meeting the guy at his apartment, E. apologized and then casually mentioned that she brought Jeremy for protection. Jeremy froze up, but the cab fare guy barely responded.
The guy who E. paid was being, in fact, the opposite of creepy. Creepy, as I partly defined earlier, is a desperate act of unrequited love. Staring, stalking, and masturbating behind window blinds. Sidling, prank-calling, and sniffing panties without permission. Those behaviors are creepy because they don’t give the woman any say as to whether she’d like to participate in the man’s fantasies of her. The man hides his thoughts out of the sake of social convention and fear of either ridicule or imprisonment. But this newly paid creep was quite up front about his thoughts. He didn’t hide behind bushes or peek through windows trying to steal glances of the girl, and he didn’t accept an invitation to work with her while lying to her in several different ways. Instead, he came right out front and stated his intentions and he was realistic and honest.
Yet Jeremy thinks that E. would consider this guy creepy. The only creepy thing in this picture will be E.’s panties once cab fare guy hands Jeremy $5 to pay his way home. But at least he’d have some money to show for this long walk.
For added fun, check out the comment section of The Hairpin piece.
Like this:
Like Loading...
“Odds are, Jeremy had his ego pelted with creep-shot…”
Creep shot, that’s a good one.
If the cab fare guy had actually handed the $5 back to the author for his trouble that would have been the best move of all time, of all time!!
Not to be a backseat blogger but this would have been a perfect post if only you had somehow worked in Radiohead
I’m a creep
I’m a weirdo
What the hell am I doing here?
I don’t belong here
I think your responses were good. He really shouldn’t get too angry about this woman calling him a creep and weird, who cares. It isn’t that big of a deal and the only thing he did was walk 40 minutes out of his way. If she is high quality she might not be willing to jump in bed that easily. I certainly wouldn’t do anything else nice for her.
A lot of women seem to expect men to walk them home at night. If you want to do it, fine, but you shouldn’t feel obligated. I walk my kids babysitters home at night, but they are teenagers and I feel responsible for them. An adult woman that you don’t even really know is not your responsibility.
If she felt so unsafe let her call a cab.
[Chuck: That would cost her money, and college girls that age don't spend their money on anything. It's really amazing. I knew girls in college who were somehow able to save up $10 k.]
The babysitters are working for me which does make me somewhat responsible for their well being. A woman you just met in a bar you don’t owe a thing. If you want to walk her home however, I think it can be considered a nice gesture. I do think it is a little presumptuous to expect her to sleep with you as a thank you.
“Pee in the bushes anyway.”
Peeing in the bushes would not have occurred to me, though it sounds like a blast. Maybe it’s a regional thing. What part of Texas did you say you were from?
[Chuck: Peeing outside in general is a pretty great feeling. No tiny oval opening to aim for. No flushing. No muss no fuss.]
From the comments:
“have a great night, I’m happy to have seen you safely home”. That would have set him apart as a gentleman and made her interested.”
[Chuck: Yeah, that was a real gem. That would have encouraged this little princess to continue putting men out under the auspices of her putting out herself. People get down on sluts who actually have sex with men, but these teases are almost as bad. They're still using their pussy, but they've figured out a way to not actually have to pull it out of its encasement.]
Dr. Grzlickson might be right, although he should say it with a devilish smile. Getting angry at her for not inviting you up to her apartment is beta behavior. Acting completely asexual is beta also.
a) This is the 21st century version of yellow (cowardly) journalism, along with all the chick gossip sites and TMZ which pretend like a celebrity visiting the local 7/11 is news-worthy
b) This neurotic self-loathing pathetic creature is a DOCTOR.. as in Dr. Mangina, the man with traumatic childhood memories will see you now. The fact that there are such incomprehensibly incompetent and emasculated “men” running around calling themselves DOCTOR is all you need to know about the current clownish state of the psychology profession.
There are three feminist enabling traitors currently ruining society and male-female relations that you should never trust:
1. a state pig (Cop)
2. a state lawyer (divorce, tort, etc)
3. a state psychologist (the enemy who pretends to be your friend and confidant)
Bankers, traders and used car salesmen are reincarnations of Mother Teresa if you compare them to the criminals above.
Would it be alpha, beta, or creepy to break out with a little Bob Seger as you’re walking her home:
[Chuck: If we're talking young women - under 35 - this would be considered creepy. I'm reading Adam Carolla's book "In 50 Years We'll All Be Chicks" and he mentions that guys who make pre year 2000 cultural references to these types of entitled dumbchicks are often looked at with condescension and told "I was barely born then. You're soooo old." Which, in women's eyes, is the ultimate mark of creepiness.]
Creepy out of the mouths of girls = beta or excessively beta male behavior. That is behavior which is in actual fact sexually unattractive in her eyes, regardless of what official codes or ideals of behavior say. There’s a reason for the word creepy (or loser) being used for such things rather than “what a jerk” and so on – the later refers more to violations of up front talked about social codes Creepy is lots more likely to be used when the guy in question is acting like he has some right to her emotional or sexual attraction, or has a shot at it when he doesn’t.
[Chuck: Exactly. As I wrote, a man that was once considered a "loser" is also now a "creep". A loser is a guy that just exists by himself - doesn't harm a soul. Women now call those same guy's creeps because *merely existing as a socially awkward guy is considered a direct attack*. I believe that it is the same phenomenon as with second-hand smoke or the domestic violence campaign where "mental abuse" conducted at the hands of a man is nothing more than him simply disagreeing with her. No longer are men only harmful if they touch a woman unprovoked; they are also harmful by their mere existence.]
He’s using creepy in a typically clueless beta way (who hasn’t swallowed the red pill of gender realism), to apply to any violation of the professed social codes, including both white knighting and feminist ones. He’s demonstrating that he has no clue what turns girls on, while cab fare guy does, or at least is aloof and non needy and non compliant enough to have lots of pull with E. Spot on Chuck that she’s lots more likely to do cab fare guy in the future.
I was joking with the Seger song; spotting ultra-beta lyrics in pop music is a specialty of mine. This one seemed particularly suited to the circumstances. I like my devilish twist of lyrics at the end.
Good call on pre-2000 references. Never thought abut that, though instinctually I avoid age-gap red flags when chatting with younger girls.
I’d have to tell her it’s a new Avril Lavigne song as I sing it.
What she’s semi consciously doing is socially shaming him for expecting a quid pro quo for the act of walking her a very long way home. Girls say the same thing about guys who expect some sexual reward after buying her a relatively expensive dinner on an early date. She’s simultaneously demanding by shaming a higher price for her sexual favors of any degree i.e. that “she can’t be bought” (at least not cheaply), and showing that bargaining doesn’t turn her on.
She’s not wrong about this. However she should feel some guilt and be subject to some mild degree of social shame if she’s knowingly leading the guy on to do her favors when she knows she’s not at all sexually attracted to him. An exploratory dinner paid for by him is different if she doesn’t know yet that it’s going nowhere sexually, even after a long enough time for her. Girls generally know what the guy really wants from them, but these days feel entitled to take advantage of beta orbiters (who can be shamed away from being pushy for something in return), or many do. Our current feminist culture attacks the idea that girls shouldn’t lead guys on, all the time. Much of any degree of shaming or guilty for that is certainly not often supported in mass entertainment media, though it definitely used to be (before the 80s some, and before the 70s more) — albeit combined with the promotion of white knighting, which was indeed a mixed message.
What he should have done earlier is to game her of course — be cocky funny, little negs, followed by non hungry seeming compliments, story telling w/DHV and comfort building, and so on. What he should have done when she asked him to walk her the long way to her place is say something like “hey you look all grown up, does the little girl really need to be walked home? Or what, do you think I’m that easy?” This will tend to make her more attracted, or if she’s definitely not sexually (which he should have sensed), make her show her cards.
Having made the mistake of walking her home (which involves a lot more putting himself out than a moderate car lift to her place) without prior real signs of her attraction, he should have reacted to her “So, I think I’m just gonna go upstairs and go to sleep”, by becoming aloof, rather than starting to bargain or reason w/her. One response would be: “Whatever. Bye then.” That might have preserved a shot at the future, by seeming hard to get and not to be played a fool. She might worry about losing his interest, rather than knowing for sure he’ll keep chasing if she wants him to.
IF there’s been chemistry going on earlier he should instead fix her eyes with his and gauge her resulting temperature. That might lead to a sexual kiss. Depends on his game earlier that night of course.
I guess most love songs have beta lyrics to a certain extent. My favorite line is from Bruce Springsteen’s Thunder Road, “You ain’t a beauty, but hey you’re alright.” (I guess it’s kind of a neg, but a nice one)
Her: “So I think I’m gonna go upstairs and go to sleep.”
Him: “Sweet, that party should still be going on.” (Run off in the direction of the party while waving good-bye)
*
Her: “Will you walk me home?”
Him: “Only if you’ll give me a piggy-back ride.”
*
Her: “Well what did you expect?”
Him: “At least a blowjob.”
*
Her: “I like you.”
Him: “That’s what they all say.”
*
Her: “I like you.”
Him: “Will you walk me home later?”
*
Her: “I like you.”
Him: “Weird. You’re the third girl to tell me that today.”
*
Her: “I like you.”
Him: “What do you mean by like?”
*
Her: “I like you.”
Him: “That’s creepy.”
Some horrendously beta lyrics from the 80s, without the song being fun/satirical or “in character,” or as follows off the top of my head follow.
By the way, songs with very confessional lyrics are not beta if they assume an existing attraction, or if the speaker shows a degree of self-awareness, for example in pining for a girl he can’t have.
Songs that bathe in their bettude and shoudl be forbidden to any boy under 18:
Jeff Healy “Angel Eyes”
Chris Deburgh “Lady in Red”
Billy Vera “At this Moment”
REO Speedwagon “Keep on Loving You”
[Chuck: I always found it odd, and I think I wrote a post about it way back, that the Billy Vera song was made popular in an episode of "Family Ties" where Michael J. Fox and his girlfriend were dancing at the prom. The Vera song has a lyric that goes "faced with the knowledge that you just don't love me no more"...but MJF is in a relationship with the girl he's dancing with. They are ostensibly happy with each other. Offset these songs with the empowering female analogue at the time: the Hearts, Madonnas, Cindy Laupers.]
Interesting post, Chuck. Some thoughts.
As far as I can tell, the words or terms “creepy” and the like don’t seem to come up all that often on the Black hand side. Not entirely sure why this is, although from what I can tell, the term “ninjas” (which is supposed to be a take on the word “Niggas”) has cropped up, and is often used along the same ways “Nigga” is, that is to say, it can have broad applications. Still, it’s kind of hard to say.
At any rate, I think that if a guy in this day and age, where true knowledge of Women is only a few mouseclicks away still puts himself out there to be used along chivalrous lines, deserves to get got, as we say in the hood. He has no one but himself to blame, because he is offering something and can’t be mad or upset if a Woman takes him up on it. True, in a fair world Women like that which is being discussed in the piece would reciprocate and be square dealing, but that’s not the world in which we live. It just isn’t. The sooner Men learn about these things and protect themselves, the better. It really is as simple as that.
As for the Woman in the post above, while I certainly see the points you’re making, I’m having a hard time why any guy should care what she or any other Woman in such a situation was saying. The bottomline here is that she tried to stiff a guy out her share for cabfare. If anything, she’s a deadbeat, or at least, tried to welch out of her end of the bargain, and should be roundly excoriated for it, just like Men do to each other when such things happen. Part of the reason why chivalry is on life support, instead of having long been rightly buried, is because Men themselves keep trying to keep it alive, in ways big and small. We not only need to let it die, but we should also give it a great big heave off the roof.
O.
Rge REO Speedwagon song does have a redeeming quality in that the speaker seems like he’s bent on revenge; there is certainly a decent amount of anger in the lyrics.
But the first three are horrible.
Chuck: I always found it odd [...] that [...] the Vera song has a lyric that goes “faced with the knowledge that you just don’t love me no more”…but MJF is in a relationship with the girl he’s dancing with. They are ostensibly happy with each other.
Eighties sitcome writers were redlining it on coke. Paglia in fact wrote something about that. It’s futile to expect too much thematic consistence in that decade’s TV.
Offset these songs with the empowering female analogue at the time: the Hearts, Madonnas, Cindy Laupers.]
As a teenager in the eighties, I remember those songs and a certain pop cultural zeitgeist very vividly. There was a wierd thing going on in that decade, masculinity-wise. Pastel tones, Wayfarers, docksiders, polo shirts. Collar flipped up if you’re nasty. It wasn’t exactly beta. It was very preppy.
Raw masculinity was marginalized: relegated to trailer parks and headbanger concerts. Blacks were off the radar except as smooth crooners who enounciated their lyrics. But mainstream alpha was part Risky Business, part Michael J. Fox; throw in Richard Marx for good measure: smart, clean-cut, with just a hint of naughty. Hence so many beta lyrics. They weren’t JUST about wallowing in self-deprecation. Those songs signaled just the right kind of sensibility for its times. Of course, when you flirt with “being a clean-cut nice guy” that way, you can slip and fall into all-out bathos. Hence Billy Vera, and later Jeff Healy.
I should also stress that it was a decade of self-disclosure, and its cousin sensitivity. Hence the confessional tone of so many songs back then. Again, you get too close to sincerity, you slip and let it all go. Sort of like the Seinfeld episode a decade later, when Jerry started letting his feelings speak, and devolved into a blubbering mess of bathos.
PA,
Again, I don’t know where you get your knowledge about pop culture Americana from.
Black masculinity was marginalized? Uh, the 1980s was dominated not just by Hip Hop, but Gangsta Rap in particular. Run DMC made major waves by being among the first Black acts, and definitely the first Hip Hop act, to be featured on MTV. BET came online in the 80s, and featured NWA and MC Hammer, just to name a few. Dr. Dre soon became a household name. And an early Tupac was on the rise, at the time a sideman in the group Digital Underground, but soon to be on his own in the following decade, the 90s (btw: per Wikipedia, Tupac has now sold upwards of 80MIL albums worldwide). To be sure, the preppy look was in in certain circles, and that includes Blacker ones. But please do not get it twisted, Gangsta Rap in particular, had a strong hold in the 80s and was in no way marginalized.
Not by a longshot.
O.
My favorite songs are usually love songs, almost always written by a man, but not overly sappy ones. That “Angel Eyes” song is horrible. My roommate in college loved “Lady in Red” and I remember my mom saying she seems like the type of girl that would like that song.
I heard “Wonderful Tonight” on the radio today and I thought, I’ve probably listened to this song hundreds of times in my life and I still love it. It is loving and soulful, but doesn’t seem beta.” Diamonds and Rust” is a great song about unrequited love written by a woman, but it is usually men who write the best love songs.
Obsidian:
I see what PA is saying. I don’t think he’s saying that raw masculinity or the specific forms of black masculinity were marginalized and therefore didn’t exist. I think he’s saying that they were put into their own little bins rather than being allowed to escape into the ether of mainstream popular culture.
The mainstream culture, the Michael J. Fox and the glam-rock and Wham!, was made up of dorky or effeminate white men. No room for traditional masculinity. Where more traditional masculinity did exist – in gangsta rap circles or through Husker Du or early Metallica – it was compartmentalized. Just turn to MTV: apart from traditional mainstream culture you had “Headbangers Ball” and “Yo! MTV Raps”. Masculinity existed, but it was sort of pushed to the side and regarded as a sort of side show rather than a preferred form of male behavior.
Obsidian, I am speaking about mainstream pop culture. Casey Casem’s Top 40, hit movies, and prime time sitcoms.
I heard “Wonderful Tonight” on the radio today and I thought, I’ve probably listened to this song hundreds of times in my life and I still love it.
That’s a classic and a great song. Love songs alone are not beta. They can be very powerful. In this song’s case, you have Clapton’s mature, years-beaten voice speaking softly about his woman’s beauty. It’s a great song.
One of my all-time favorite love songs, in such a mature, been-to-hell and back sort of way, is Lou Reed’s “Perfect Day.”
A cool thing about that song is that if you substitute the word “sangrias” in the lyrics with “milkshakes,” it can also be a beautiful song about spending the day with your child.
“Wonderful Tonight” is like Ulysses thanking the olympian gods for his wife Penelope’s faithfullness.
“Perfect Day” is a great song, it’s one of my brother’s favorites. My aunt wanted to use “Wonderful Tonight” at her wedding, but my uncle thought it was too much about her and made her pick something else. I honestly think what separates merely good rock and roll musicians from the great ones is the ability to write a love song. The best ones can do both.
Obsidian,
Sam Cooke had some very good love songs.
Yeah, in “Wonderful Tonight” she is actually the one taking care of him and he is grateful for that.
Who goes back to see someone they don’t like over $5? And if the woman in the story wanted to clear her debt on principle, why not just mail the guy that called her a cunt the $5, in cash with no return address? Seems better than re-encountering someone she feels she needs a bodyguard to talk to.
[Chuck: I actually contacted the author of this piece to ask him that question, but he told me that there is no way the girl E. was sexually attracted to the guy. According to the author, E. "had to" make things right with this guy in order to prevent word of her bad behavior getting around in her niche artist community. Still, why not mail it, why not give it to someone else to give to him, why not give him the 5 bucks when you see him out again. The author may think that the girl didn't find the other guy attractive, but the author has already proven himself to not understand how women work.]
Back then I don’t think pop culture revolved around women and all their “fabulousness” and it was more romantic because of that.
what separates merely good rock and roll musicians from the great ones is the ability to write a love song
In an interview circa 1992, REM’s frontman Michael Stipe was asked about love songs on their upcoming album. Stipe snarled and said that he doesn’t write love songs because there is no such thing as an intelligent love song.
LOL, I always found him annoying. Granted, REM did “Everybody Hurts,” so they weren’t always ironic-cerebral-incoherent (a la “Out of Time”). But Stipe must have been a beta in private. He and Natalie Merchant of 10,000 Maniacs were once an item. In an interview, Merchant was asked about her relationship with Stipe. She recoiled and said, with horror on her face, that they’re good friends.
Well, either he’s a beta, or he pumped-n-dumped her. hehe. I didn’t like her much either.
Yeah, I did watch a lot of MTV in the early 90s, when I wasn’t washing dished and doing manual labor in now fondly-remembered shithouse establishments.
[Chuck: I thought Stipe was gay? I thought Natalie Merchant was gay too. What's a new term for a fag hag/beard combo?]
Yeah, in “Wonderful Tonight” she is actually the one taking care of him and he is grateful for that
My wife doesn’t drink so I too am grateful for never having to be the designated driver
Well you’re lucky about that. My husband hardly drinks at all so he usually drives.
If Natalie Merchant recoiled in horror at the suggestion that she and Michael Stripes were lovers, he is beta. It’s all in a woman’s body language how she feels about a particular man.
I thought Stipe was gay? I thought Natalie Merchant was gay too.
Never considered that either is gay, but that’s not an implausability with either of them. I vividly recall her uncomfortable reation to the question about her “relationship” (interviewer’s word) with Stipe. Did I wrongly infer a normal bang-based relationship between the two?
A quick google search comes up with some references to their having had a “close relationship,” and Merchant’s confession to having had a crush on Stipe when she first met him.
your new format sucks
being more constructive it’s to white
@ PA:
I’d have to tell her it’s a new Avril Lavigne song as I sing it.
Actually thinking Avril’s still relevant would date you more than a Bob Seger reference.
Chuck–
Yeah I see too and agree with both of you. Except I don’t think it was a matter of black music and self promotion of a black masculine / borderline or in fact thug image, not being “allowed to escape” into mainstream culture.
Rather it wasn’t then being super promoted on MTV, VH1 etc., as something for white people, especially white girls, as it is now and has been for at least ten years, and has been in mainstream movies and TV for the last 5. You didn’t see tons of black guys having hot white girlfriends in movies and TV then; it more reflected the actual reality where that happened but not that often. This started changing in the late 90s I think. It was a gradual but especially during the oughts, it accelerated.
I think one of the principal attractions of rap for white guys came to be the clearly anti-feminist, pro male dominance of girls undertone and explicit message – views that were far more suppressed through outraged feminist shaming carried out in the media etc. when it was done through some largely white style. Feminists bitched about rap too especially in general, but white ones soon stopped taking on rap artists directly, there was so much pushback from the black community, including from black women when the chips were down re: white feminist media megaphone attempted shaming.
[Chuck: So basically whatever white women think is cool becomes the mainstream of society. This would seem to be true since most anti-establishment movements in music tend to be largely male influenced. Punk, rap, hipsterdom, etc.
Pingback: No Woman Is Unable To Find A Man « Omega Virgin Revolt
“Creepy” is just one of the meaningless accusations women use to dismiss a man without any further explanation. It’s much similar to politicans accusing each other of “populism”. It means “I’m rejecting you but I cannot be bothered to explain why, just get lost”.
Best line in the post:
But girls have tits and, thus, no need for logic, etiquette, or manners.
Should be your tag line.
And @Höllenhund
“Creepy” is just one of the meaningless accusations women use to dismiss a man without any further explanation. It’s much similar to politicans accusing each other of “populism”. It means “I’m rejecting you but I cannot be bothered to explain why, just get lost”.
Yes.
Pingback: Linkage is Good for You: It Will Never End Edition
@Chuck
1. Beard/Merkin (to answer your question about a relationship between a gay man and a gay woman.) Merkins are pubic wigs (one of the telltale signs of sexual promiscuity in women pre-antibiotics was the lack of pubic hair-often shaven to treat/prevent crab lice or lost as a result of mercury treatment for STDs). With a telltale qualifier of health in women being an abundance of hair (from head to legs), the lack of pubic hair acted as a symbol of “immaturity” (too young to breed), “malnutrition” (too poor to afford good food=bad breeding stock) or “disease” (syphillis was and still is no joke, so mercury was the way to go to prevent the side effects), so fake pubic wigs were used to prevent loss of income/marital prospects for prostitutes or college girls who allowed themselves to be seduced by the wrong man.
2. White, teenaged to pre-matriculation women are a culture’s taste arbiters because they tend to have the most dispensible income. And as long as men are refusing to insist on the most “fuckable”/viable women to pull their own financial weight, they’ll always have enough money to force us to enjoy Justin Bieber and “Twilight” (because the media sees them as an infinte cash target and will adjust their output accordingly.) A husband with a family, a mother with children, a guy on the prowl, an elderly person with a pension, all of these people have limiters to cash flow (family needs to be protected, women need to be wined and dined, insurance needs to be paid, etc.) A young woman, however, who’s basic needs (food, housing, health care, etc.) are being met by parents and who’s emotional needs/ego (restaurant meals, movies, new clothes/accessories, etc) are being met by suitors can afford to spend all of their surplus income on whatever catches their fancy without fear of deprivation.
Side note-for all of our complaints of the feminization of the American man, Jacob (the swarthy, hair{ier} and more athletic/buff looking member of the Twilight love triangle) gets more online attention than the explicitly fey Edward.
3. I wouldn’t have walked 40 minutes for the opportunity to possibly, maybe have sex with a woman, ever. I wouldn’t walk for 40 minutes to meet a woman who found herself “accidentally” locked into a pair of those vibrating panties and was begging for me to bring my lockpicks to her apartment. The few women for whom I would walk 40 minutes are related to me.